[Mireille] go
[forlornhope] go
[Noirlax] Go~! :milano::alita:
[ShadowBlazer3000] go
[MartAnimE] Go~! :alita:
[MartAnimE] those illustrations with the nude bodies and the cables are kinda interesting
[Noirlax] yeah :smile:
[ShadowBlazer3000] techno horror :scream:
[MartAnimE] not sure if it really relates to the story much :smile:
[MartAnimE] but it looks cool
[forlornhope] fanservice :smile:
[Noirlax] lol yeah
[MartAnimE] most likely :smile:
[ShadowBlazer3000] BT sure did love having nudity in their credits
[Noirlax] usually is
[MartAnimE] but Bee Train is always tasteful about their nudity
[MartAnimE] I like what she said here
[MartAnimE] "geting used to this new body"
[MartAnimE] that would definitely be an issue
[MartAnimE] she's Queen now
[MartAnimE] Murder Queen
[MartAnimE] gotta change the anime title
[MartAnimE] I forgot they had this conversation about getting a boyfriend :smile:
[Noirlax] me too
[MartAnimE] Kaito sure is amazing huh :V
[Noirlax] :v yeah
[Noirlax] I do like these little moments where they think to themselves
[MartAnimE] I gotta say, it's a little weird that Milano develops a crush on Alita while she's in her body
[ShadowBlazer3000] this reminds me of El Cazador when Nadie and Fallis have a similar argument
[forlornhope] lol yeah
[MartAnimE] it's really kinda uncomfortable :smile:
[Noirlax] You mean Ellis?
[ShadowBlazer3000] lol
[ShadowBlazer3000] yeah Ellis
[MartAnimE] oh yeah when they break Ellis' charm
[forlornhope] cool bike
[MartAnimE] hover bike
[forlornhope] :fire: :motorcycle:
[MartAnimE] "these are difficult times we're living in"
[Noirlax] yeah
[MartAnimE] best line so far
[Noirlax] yeah nice bike
[MartAnimE] she's religious
[MartAnimE] I suppose most royals are religious
[ShadowBlazer3000] yeah it's a spiritual world for sure
[MartAnimE] the whole "appointed by god" plays a big role in the whole thing
[ShadowBlazer3000] in the manga only, Falis/Alita says she's an atheist
[MartAnimE] yeah, that sounds about right
[Noirlax] oh no Milano
[MartAnimE] do they know Milano is the real princess?
[MartAnimE] or they just knew she was close to the princess
[MartAnimE] these robots are too smart
[Noirlax] oh no
[ShadowBlazer3000] we're about chapter 8 now
[MartAnimE] "I'm tired" "it's cuz you're running" :laughing:
[ShadowBlazer3000] i haven't read volume 2 yet but skimming it, seems there's a lot of differences here
[MartAnimE] you know what, I might wanna read the manga too after the rewatch
[Noirlax] yeah
[MartAnimE] see if it wraps things up a bit better
[ShadowBlazer3000] the dub changes their internal voices so Milano/Alita has her original Alita voice. Falis/Alita has her original Falis voice
[MartAnimE] "like a moth to flame" how cliche :smile:
[MartAnimE] it's weird they started interrogation with a gun then switched to a knife
[Noirlax] ouch
[ShadowBlazer3000] :alita: Shut.up!
[MartAnimE] she's gonna die on her feet
[Noirlax] she's become so noble
[MartAnimE] oh it's Kaito
[MartAnimE] was that his name?
[MartAnimE] the brother
[ShadowBlazer3000] yeah
[Noirlax] yeah Prince Kaito
[ShadowBlazer3000] the manga says his name is Kite but that might be translation difference
[MartAnimE] oh fun :smile:
[Noirlax] torture party :sweat_smile:
[MartAnimE] a .hack// connection
[MartAnimE] the brother would probably notice his sister is not really his sister :sweat_smile:
[ShadowBlazer3000] hey. the king's back!
[Noirlax] He's under the control of that lady
[MartAnimE] that's true, but we're not supposed to know that yet :smile:
[Noirlax] They did a good job of packing two sets of antagonists in 6 episodes I have to say
[MartAnimE] yeah everything is so fast
[Mireille] I never got the impression he was controlled.
[Mireille] He wanted to destroy the world for his own reasons.
[MartAnimE] oh
[Mireille] And the lady just used that to her own ends.
[Noirlax] oh well I don't mean mind controlled
[MartAnimE] I know he's working with the evil lady
[ShadowBlazer3000] Marvelous Entertainment they also produced Meine Liebe Wieder
[Mireille] At least that's what the dialog at the end seems to imply.
[MartAnimE] but don't remember his motives much
[Noirlax] It's a shame they have to pack so much in in so few eps
[Mireille] I think we don't learn his motives till the final episode.
[MartAnimE] guess we'll see then
[MartAnimE] yeah, it feels really fast to me because they don't have much time
[Noirlax] But it's been pretty enjoyable
[Noirlax] and a good deal of drama
[Mireille] Some things feel a bit abbreviated, but I'm not sure it would gain anything from going 12 episodes.
[MartAnimE] I know I'm in the minority, but I still think it's just fine, not a lot of emotional investment from me :sweat_smile:
[ShadowBlazer3000] the magazine that MP was serialized in merged into another publication
[Mireille] Unless the first series was the start and things continued after.
[Mireille] That ended the run?
[Noirlax] Most of my emotional investment is in Milano and to some degree Alita
[ShadowBlazer3000] that was a year after this anime but i could see that being the reason the run finished or they opted for a quick 6-part OVA instead of committing to a one or two cour show
[forlornhope] Nice action scenes but yeah I'm not as invested in the characters
[MartAnimE] interesting Alex
[ShadowBlazer3000] sometimes manga do jump publications but i don't know they said "We're not gonna pick you up" or the author just felt he told the story he wanted to tell and concluded it
[MartAnimE] certainly a different territory for Bee Train, which is not a bad a thing, feel like their strength is in slow paced and more quiet stories
[forlornhope] True
[Noirlax] yeah true Marta but I feel they add those little moments of thought and intimacy that make action series better too
[Noirlax] Like that little broken toy or when they ponder stuff
[Noirlax] Bee Train isn't some sakuga crazy studio
[MartAnimE] yeah, those little moments are nice, just feel overshadowed by all the action
[Noirlax] and the story
[forlornhope] Sorry I really need to go to bed. Long day :sleepy:
[MartAnimE] I do wonder if Bee Train picked this project (or were picked for the project?) for any particular reason related to their previous work, other than the yuri subtext of course :smile:
[forlornhope] Night all. Thanks for the rewatch
[ShadowBlazer3000] good night brooke
[forlornhope] :dog:
[MartAnimE] Bai Bai Brooke :dog:
[Noirlax] Good night Brooke thanks for staying up
[MartAnimE] thanks for joining!
[MartAnimE] ***
[Noirlax] bai bai :dog:
[Noirlax] ***
[Noirlax] I wonder Marta :smile:
[ShadowBlazer3000] as I said Marvelous did produce Meine Liebe Wider so there's a connection there. MMV probably chose them based on that
[MartAnimE] Meine Liebe is very different, but you'll get to see it when we rewatch :smile:
[MartAnimE] but yeah, that makes sense
[ShadowBlazer3000] i would assume this probably got rolling in 2006 and they also would have certainly been prepping El Caz at that time too
[Noirlax] This was from Bee Train's B team?
[MartAnimE] I find Meine Liebe was very character focused and slow paced
[MartAnimE] which are very Bee Train qualities
[ShadowBlazer3000] yeah kind of
[ShadowBlazer3000] a B-team project
[MartAnimE] the only odd thing was no female characters in sight :smile:
[Noirlax] :smile:
[ShadowBlazer3000] one of the few Mashimo didn't direct
[Noirlax] yeah but there is still some Mashimo-ish directing in there
[MartAnimE] probably
[Noirlax] A few of the pans, stares and suspense in MP was like that to me
[ShadowBlazer3000] yeah given it's one of his own regular Episode Directors as opposed to someone from the outside like for Arc, Medabots or Spider-Riders
[MartAnimE] brb :dog:
[Noirlax] ok
[Noirlax] I felt somehow if MP was longer it probably be more noticable mainstream. It's pacing is more like mainstream action anime to me.
[ShadowBlazer3000] yeah maybe
[ShadowBlazer3000] but 2007 was also when Naruto Shippuden launched so it may not have really garned any more success
[Noirlax] yeah and it's many years before stuff like AoT as well
[ShadowBlazer3000] and before internet streaming really took off
[Noirlax] yeah
[ShadowBlazer3000] brb
[Noirlax] ok
[Noirlax] This makes me think how Bee Train will survive today. In a way they would but production committees probably wouldn't give the go-ahead to some of the earlier work. On the other hand later works and adaptations probably would have more mileage perhaps?
[MartAnimE] ok back
[MartAnimE] I dunno if Murder Princess would really become a mainstream success
[MartAnimE] feel like even by action and gore standards it's kinda tame
[MartAnimE] the violence just looks cartoonish to me
[Noirlax] probably isn't a big budget series
[Noirlax] but still it seems kinda obscure
[MartAnimE] I actually had this thought, that whoever wrote the manga came up with concept art for a princess splattered with blood and wielding a katana, and that was their first idea for this show, and the whole rest of the show was written around it :smile:
[MartAnimE] that's the feeling I get from Murder Princess
[Noirlax] :smile: maybe
[MartAnimE] it just feels like style over substance
[MartAnimE] but I can't speak for the manga
[Noirlax] I don't feel it's shallow though, it's not deep either
[MartAnimE] I can see how the anime tries to build something more between Alita and Milano
[MartAnimE] I wonder how it compares to their relationship in the manga
[Noirlax] I feel the substance never gets fully developed because of it's length however
[MartAnimE] that'd be really interesting to compare
[Mireille] It's hard to say if we are seeing hints of attraction on Milano's part. I mean it's her body Falis is in, so... gross.
[MartAnimE] I know, that's what I was saying
[Mireille] But it might be interesting commentary on attraction not being tied to the physical.
[Noirlax] More attracted to the soul than the body.
[Mireille] In the sense that Alight might like Falis, and not be concerned with the body she is in.
[MartAnimE] if she is attracted to the personality she should at least be having inner thoughts about how it feels weird to be attracted to someone who's in her previous body
[Noirlax] but then again they both have good bods :smile:
[Mireille] That's a good point Marta.
[Noirlax] maybe Marta but the show doesn't have time for that
[Mireille] Although I would say Bee Train does inner dialogs without words i.e. Kirika.
[MartAnimE] yeah true
[MartAnimE] both of you
[Noirlax] They do that better than most with inner dialogs without words but they can do it with words too
[MartAnimE] I feel like I might actually enjoy this show more if it was just about them trying to find a way to switch back or finding out it's impossible and learning to cope with it, and falling in love in the middle of it all
[MartAnimE] just sounds so much more interesting to me :smile:
[Mireille] Yeah that sort of thing could have been used to extend the show.
[Mireille] But I reminded of that ep in Shirobako where the Director has to go full on Samurai Cowboy just to get his own vision through to the creator.
[Noirlax] That could have happened Marta but the main plot is about saving the country and the ancient tech to me. In a way with the 6 ep slot they had they covered the whole story at least.
[Noirlax] But I guess you're kinda frustrated at it being a bit too premise driven?
[Mireille] They could have really finished things up if destroying Te Oria returned them to the correct bodies.
[Mireille] The way that bit is left open ended makes me think there was going to be a part 2, but for whatever reason it didn't happen.
[MartAnimE] I think my biggest problem is the body switch doesn't actually make that much of a difference for the plot about saving the country and the ancient tech, they probably could have done that without switching bodies
[MartAnimE] why have such an unusual premise if you're not gonna fully explore it?
[MartAnimE] seems like a waste to me
[Mireille] Without that twist it would just be a tired old recitation of the fantasy tropes.
[Noirlax] The plot might not have changed much but those moments between Alita and Milano wouldn't be as interesting without the switch
[ShadowBlazer3000] i feel that because I've come up with stories that way too
[Mireille] It would little different from The Sword and the Sorcerer
[MartAnimE] nothing wrong with that Alex :smile:
[MartAnimE] and I can relate too in a way, back in my teenage years I created so many crazy characters, and I'd put so much emphasis on how they looked and I'd just get a basic idea of the type of characters they were, but I'd never get any further and really develop them
[MartAnimE] I didn't even gave them names
[MartAnimE] it was rather shallow, but that's normal for teenagers and it did help me practice the basics of character design
[Noirlax] Nothing wrong with giving a core concept and going from there, it's what you do from there I guess.
[Noirlax] But in a lot of shows and character designs the visuals pretty much give the character away doesn't it?
[MartAnimE] maybe?
[MartAnimE] depends on the type of anime I guess
[ShadowBlazer3000] that's in general why i like anime a lot. the character designs and visuals can be so creative
[Noirlax] I was thinking broader like in western animation as well
[ShadowBlazer3000] i didn't like Wandering Witch much but damn if I didn't find the art super appealing
[MartAnimE] I think you want the design to match their personality yes
[MartAnimE] but you could also create a character who is hiding their true self
[MartAnimE] so there might be a dissonance between design and personality
[Noirlax] does that happen a lot?
[MartAnimE] which is also cool in its own way
[MartAnimE] I think it can be done really clever, for example, Charlotte from Madoka, has a very cartoonish, goofy and childish design, and she hides a very violent and dangerous nature
[Noirlax] ah ok
[MartAnimE] I rather like that sort of intentional dissonance
[Noirlax] oh I'm pretty neutral about that
[MartAnimE] I just love the super flat style too, so there's that :smile:
[MartAnimE] anyways, we can go back to Murder Princess
[Noirlax] I'm not really a fan of that, yeah back to Murder Princess. My main feeling atm is awww, that was 3 eps and that's half the series.
[MartAnimE] yeah, I would like to spend more time with these characters
[Noirlax] Cause I enjoyed what was there
[MartAnimE] 6 episodes feels too short
[ShadowBlazer3000] yeah it would have been great to really have this be a long form series but for what we do get I think they do all right by it. It really is a relic of the bygone era of OVAs
[Noirlax] yeah
[MartAnimE] they don't make OVAs anymore?
[ShadowBlazer3000] they do but they're always extra episodes of a series
[Noirlax] like 2 eps max?
[ShadowBlazer3000] it seems rarely they're straight adaptations like Murder Princess (or the Kubikiri Cycle OVAs)
[ShadowBlazer3000] yeah maybe 2 maybe a few more but usually they're just like "Well that could have easily just been an episode anywhere in the series"
[MartAnimE] yeah, I see what you mean
[Noirlax] yeah I get ya like K-ON
[MartAnimE] any more thoughts about Murder Princess or should I close the log?
[Noirlax] That's it from me.
[ShadowBlazer3000] think I've said what I'd like to say
[MartAnimE] okies, I'm done aswell
[MartAnimE] thank you all for joining :smile:
[Mireille] Night all.
[ShadowBlazer3000] good night
[ShadowBlazer3000] thanks for coming
[ShadowBlazer3000]
https://imgur.com/oz9tuYo[Noirlax] Night
[MartAnimE] Bai Bai James :dog:
[MartAnimE] ***
[MartAnimE] ~ THE END ~
